Can Not Record

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donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Can Not Record

Post by donrandall »

Okay gang - I am befuddled! What was it the man said? I've never been lost, but I was once befuddled for a few days? Well, I am befuddled and I don't got a few days - I really need some help now. I have a twenty five page script to record for a client and I can not get any sound to input to Goldwave!

Here's the scoop - I took everything apart to dust and clean. Yeah - I know. I know.....but...but...but...I have taken this stuff apart and put it back together more than once over the years and never a problem.....but now, after putting it all back together, Goldwave does not register any input. The needles on the VU meter do not kick and nothing records. This is embarassing - I ain't no rookie or newbie - I've been using Goldwave for years.

I have checked all the cables and connections, I have confirmed that there is output signal by routing into my cassette deck, the VU meter registers input and I can record.

I then fired up Music Match Juke Box - the mp3 player application - and started playing some music. Usually, I can open Goldwave and capture the audio playback - - but not now. Nothing. Deadsville.

I am thinking it must be a software setting, either in Windows or in Goldwave. I have checked the Windows settings that I am aware of - those in the Volume Control - and it all seems to be in order, nothing is muted. Are there others that I should know about?

I then checked "Control Properties" in Goldwave and all seems to be just as it should be. Just to be thorough, I did experiment by selecting other options, nothing changed so I went back to original settings.

***I just came back to add this addendum: I opened another digital editing program that I have and that one works just fine.....well.....it works. It ain't Goldwave and it really kinda stinks. But - it will record! That tells me that everything is Peachy Keen with hardware and wiring, and really kinda Nifty Dandy with Windows -- so I gotta have something messed up in my Goldwave settings. Any ideas?

I don't know what is messed up, probably something simple - but whatever it is - I mustamist it, and I am befuddled and need help!
piano nick
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:33 pm

Post by piano nick »

Don:

The only thing I can think of (other than the setting in Windows) is the DEVICE settings in Control Properties.

In my setup for DEVICES, GW reads: E-DSP Wave [C000] - for both Playback and Record. This is for my EMU 1820M audio device.

Then there is also the TEST tab under Control Properties.


PN
donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Post by donrandall »

Hi Nick!

Thanks for jumpin' in - man, I need the help!

In Control Properties, I select Device. For Playback, I select Real Tek HD Audio rear output, which is my normal and usual setting. Playback works just fine.

For Record, I select Back Line in/Mic, front line in, my normal and usual setting which has always worked just fine.

The other choices available are a digital input and some other inputs/output available behind a little door on the front of my computer and a few outputs for surround sound - none of these are appropriate for my use, so I am confident that I have selected the appropriate inputs and outputs. The output works fine in Goldwave - no problem there. I can record just fine in another program that I have (Wavepad), so I know that my Windows settings are okay, all my hardware is working, cables are not a problem and all wiring is correct and proper.

This really has me stumped! Again - I thank you for jumping in!
donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Post by donrandall »

Even more befuddling - it is now working.

After going through a routine of checking every possible setting in both Goldwave and Windows, and checking and rechecking everything multiple times, in frustration I uninstalled Goldwave (V 5.13) and then downloaded and reinstalled (V 5.13).

I went from absolutely zero input to a very weak input - just enought to barely move the needle on the analog meter.

That encouraged me to change the designated input in Goldwave's Control Properties / Volume to Stereo Mix and then fire up Music Match Jukebox and play some music and see if Goldwave would register anything. It did! The needles were showing a strong feed.

I then went back into Properties / Volume and again selected Line In 1 or 2 - and then opened my mic and tried it again. All I did at this point was snap my fingers in front of the mic - and I observed a nice strong movement of the needle! I am now getting much better input signal, although I now have the volume control set at 50% to get the same recording level as I previously registered with a setting of 25%.

In any event, the signal is now strong enough to be usable and it seems to be working. No changes in cables, no changes in hardware, no changes in the way wires or cables are routed.

A mystery to be sure.
Togglehead
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:37 pm
Location: Jersey

Post by Togglehead »

honestly....i would reseat your soundcard.

have you made any hardware changes recently? did you remove the battery on your motherboard?
piano nick
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:33 pm

Post by piano nick »

Don:

Since you have gone through all the steps and processes to set things up, I tend to concur with Togglehead - it seems more like a hardware issue than software.

A fellow had a similar problem on "productionforums.com" a couple weeks ago. He had two high end soundcards (M-Audio and EMU 1820M) and the EMU gave him poor sound from his mic, while the M-Audio was good.

Someone suggested switching cables, and the M-Audio suddenly wasn't too good. The cables were all new.

As I recall, he also had a second hardware problem related to the mics.

Loose PCI cards have been implicated in quite a few problems also. One user commented that he just gave his external soundcard a whack on the top when it started acting up - he was serious, and claimed it worked.


PN
donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Post by donrandall »

Thank you, gentlemen!

I appreciate your interest, your help and the suggestions.

I did get it working again. I would love to tell you what I did to correct the problem, but I really can't explain it.

All hardware remained the same, no changes. I use this stuff every day, so I know all my settings intimately, and nothing was out of adjustment there. All cables remained the same, but I did swap a few around just to see if they would send a signal to another source. All cables checked out just fine.

You've heard the definition of insanity as being the persistent repetition of the same thing, expecting different results next time? Well, I kept thinking about that as my frustration grew.

I kept playing with the various settings in Windows and in Goldwave - doing the same things over and over again. At one point, I switched out of "Line In" from the Goldwave "Properties" menu and selected "Stereo Mix". At that point, I could get music from my hard drive to play through Music Match Juke Box and register the needles in the Goldwave analog meter. That was encouraging, so I then went back into the "Properties" menu and selected "Line In" once again and then tried playing music through my MMJB program again - and now, all of a sudden, after not working and causing me much frustration - everything began to work again.! I do have to set my volume adjustment a bit higher now than before - but that is no problem because I was running it rather low before anyway.

So - it's working. It doesn't make sense, but it is working and that is all that counts!
piano nick
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:33 pm

Post by piano nick »

Don:

I'm glad that you have your system up and running again. What has transpired is baffling.

However as an engineer, I am an adherant to the "cause and effect" approach. I also know Mr. Murphy quite well - I've spent my career in structural engineering designing things to thwart Mr. Murphy and his cursed law.

In short, what has happened to you already may well (and probably will) happen again. So in effect, I'm advising that you keep trying to get to the bottom of this problem so that it doesn't crop up at a really inopportune time; a time when you can't solve it once more.

Although it could be a software related thing, I haven't experienced software problems that come and go so neatly - how does software code mutate to an unusable state, then mutate back to the correct state? Togglehead may have pointed us in the right direction - I tend to think it is hardware related.

You mentioned that you are using Realtek Audio - my understanding is that this is the "onboard" soundchip - the one that in the opinion of some is best used for beeps, chirps and tweets indicating Windows processes - for non-singing voice it is probably just fine, but not for serious or semi-serious music. While it is less likely to develop a loose connection than a plug-in soundcard (mine is PCI and uses two slots, plus a proprietary connecting cable to an external control box), there is still the chance that a connection on your motherboard (or the onboard battery) is the underlying problem.

On another music forum, the problem of bad capacitors was raised. While I think the case was over-stated, it is still a possibility that might be checked.

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/for ... did=828108

Repeating myself - bottom line - the problem will probably rear its ugly head again. For your sake, I hope not, but I used to be a Boy Scout and they taught us to be Be Prepared.


Nick
Togglehead
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:37 pm
Location: Jersey

Post by Togglehead »

this does sound like your soundcard is going south.....unless as above stated its onboard, then the hcip itself might be going south after a while of overactive use.

In this case....what kind of Motherboard do you have....Brand, platform, Etc.

Soundcard?

Have you reinstalled XP recently? Are you using XP? Intel? Hyperthreading? Are your bios settings the same? Is your chip Overclocked or anything like that?

Im a hardware nut by night....ask away!
donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Post by donrandall »

Nick, Togglehead - thanks guys! You are both way above my level with all that technical stuff. I just use it.

My soundcard is the onboard card, the computer is a year and a half old, HP Media Center 1072 and I don't fool around with any hotrodding tricks.

I do professional voiceovers and the soundcard is plenty good enough for my use - any shortcomings don't seem to be noticeable for voice work.

Everything has been working fine since I last mentioned my difficulties and I have completed my project with no further problems. Even though I burned the raw unprocessed audio to the producer, I also spent some time and made a copy of the track that I could process without stepping on the original. I then denoised, lightly compressed and noise gated the audio. Once that was done, I then set about doing some finish editing and audio sweetening. I did this so I could get a better idea of what the finished product would sound like without having to wait for the producer to finish other projects and then get to mine....well, his actually. In any event, I think it came out pretty well and there were no more hiccups of any kind during those hours of hard use.

I still can't explain what happened, I got it working, but as far as I know, it was nothing that I did. It just got tired of toying with me, I guess!

Thanks again, gentlemen!
Togglehead
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:37 pm
Location: Jersey

Post by Togglehead »

Sure thing! Just let us know of any other strange activity. I wouldnt be convinced it perfect yet, but go ahead and use it like you would, cuz if anything will bring the demon out again....using it will.

In the years i have been working with these PCs (i'll say Mac too, but hardly as much) i've seen so many unexplainable "events" happen. Sometimes you just have to chalk it up to machine spirit and say...."It didnt feel like recording for a bit."

Glad its all ok so far!
donrandall
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 11:06 pm
Location: Denver, Colorado

Post by donrandall »

As long as it's working, I am happy.

If I have any problem traceable to the soundcard, I will replace it. I am thinking of an Echo Mia if I go with an internal card or one of the M-Audio firewire boxes or more likely, the Eureka Firebox.

One of my considerations is having use of a duplexing card. I haven't looked closely and carefulle enough yet to know if any of the firewire boxes are - but I suspect that the Echo Mia card is a duplexing card.

Nick - do I remember correctly? Did you mention that you are using the Echo Mia card? If so, how about a user review?
piano nick
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:33 pm

Post by piano nick »

Don:

No, I'm using an EMU 1820M. It has mastering grade converters and is a real sweetheart of a card. Even with my diminished hearing, I noticed the difference between it and my (former) Extigy (by Creative). The particular card I have is the most expensive of their cards, but they have other with the same quality converters - but they must have the "M" suffix to have the good converters. I "over bought" with this card because it has way more INPUTS/OUTPUTS than I will ever use or need (18 IN and 20 OUT), hence the name 1820. There is also a 1616M (for laptops), and a 1212M. There are very good cards with lesser converters; 1820, 1616, 1212, and 0404 - the numbers again indicating the number of INPUTS/OUTPUTS.

It's a PCI card with an external Audiodock. Has two mic pre-amp INS, plus a host of features. A feature I like are the built-in FX, such as Reverb, Chorus, etc. The reverb (which I use) has eight individual adjustments that can be changed on the fly as the music is playing, making it very useful to adjust for that "right" sound.

It has a very powerful feature that causes some considerable confusion with beginners: It has an on-screen Mixer that is called Patchmix. For people like me that have never used a hardware mixer before, the concept was daunting, but it can route signals just like a full blown hardware mixer.

This guy has done a review: http://www.studio-central.com/phpbb/vie ... hp?t=18888

It is much more comprehensive than I could do.

There is also a site devoted to the EMU soundcards (not sponsored by EMU): http://www.productionforums.com/index.p ... 0219199079

This second site is interesting because one of the EMU employees comes on and answers questions - very useful.


GN
Togglehead
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:37 pm
Location: Jersey

Post by Togglehead »

nick, ive been a motu fan fan for a while now...but i like the review on this card....might change my mind for future upgrades...=]
erimsu
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 9:37 pm

I'm a newbie and ran into the same problem

Post by erimsu »

ok, i'm new to using goldwave and ran into the same problem. I have been transfering some records to electronic format (playing) throught this time I the VU meter would be in the yelllow to red area.

I unplugged the cables to move a couple of items from the stereo and when I plugged them back-up, the VU meter, is in the green. I have played/changed with the computer and GV volume settings (micro to line in, etc). Have looked online to see if anything would help...but have come up empty. Hence my posting.

I'm also confused? When I unplug the cable the VU meter hits the red?

If it's a hardware problem what can I do. Have an older HP laptop, 5190, (don't laugh or make comments...one day I will upgrade -- it still does the basic and more); i'm on ME and the sound card ESS Allegro, which I have not idea what this is...

Before I loose track, the following site

http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/audio/digitizing/

mentions that

"Can't get the levels anywhere near high enough?

On our Sound Blaster Live! 24, I've noticed a strange phenomenon: sometimes the Line In level is about 50 dB too low. But if you select some other sources, such as Microphone (which is the same jack and will therefore sound awful), then go back to Line In, the levels will be normal again. "

which sounds similar to what Don tried, well I've tried and have comeback empty.

On April 10, 2006, Togglehead states,

'honestly....i would reseat your soundcard. "

how do I do this? what is this? any suggestions would be great? Thanks
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